MBA Crystal Ball

I have graduated from NIT with a CGP of 8.55 in 2010 and was then employed with an automobile MNC in their RnD wing for 18 months (left job in end June, 2012). However, after seeing the technical side of things was interested to shift to the commercial/ management side of things. Hence, appeared for CAT and managed to get a seat at one of the IITs for pursuing MBA 2012-14 batch. Consequently, I have resigned from my job and waiting for the classes to begin. But, I strongly believe that this might not be the very best of opportunities and so planning to apply for some good US B schools right this year for 2013-15 session. I gave GMAT last week and scored 740 (had prepared for cat). I doubt if there had been any such cases of students leaving a school midway for some better school. Furthermore, I have already left my job so might be a couple of months before I can bag another one - this in case u advise to leave IIT this year and work before applying.

However, there is another worry on my minds: If I take admission in the IIT and start my coursework, can I apply simultaneously abroad to B- Schools. Wont these schools see it in bad light?"

I am sure this must be a peculiar case that you are seeing and probably the first one of sorts.

Thanks and regards,

Hi Amit,

I am raghava. I was interacting with sameer on other forum. I am planning to write the GMAT exam. My sister(s) applied for H1 in the past. They say that USCIS did not process my application even once.


Reason:1). Did not make the cut on the first occasion.
2). File not selected in the lucky dip.
3). Last time i did not make it because of too many applications.

Do you think i am on the safe side taking into consideration the above reasons. Can i go ahead and prepare for GMAT.

Can you recommend books for preparation.

// Sameer asked me to take your help for below content

I sell mutual fund products as a freelancer. I continue to do so while i work as a IT recruiter in the night.

Domains are different but what i do is the same sales/ marketing. I want to make a career in finance. However, i am not interested in doing a course in sales and marketing.

I had been through a bad time in the last ten years. I could not pursue higher education because of the same. My fate did not allow me to do what i wanted to do.

I want to bring many changes in myself. I do not know how friendly people in the US would be. I would be facing a big challenge if i happen to go to us for education or on work permit.

That is one among many reasons why i want to go to US. I have my family members living there which is a comforting factor.I like the subjects of finance and computer science. I am looking forward to do a course in finance. I would like to give myself a year or so to understand were i can contribute better and continue with that for the rest of my life.

Raghava,

//Do you think i am on the safe side taking into consideration the above reasons.//

I am still a little cloudy on this - sounds like your H1 petitions weren't "rejected". They were not considered because of various reasons. For issues of this nature you should consult with a seasoned immigration lawyer/professional, and I am not one. However, what I have seen is that someone with a record of rejections usually has a hard time justifying any petition (H1, F1, etc.) at the interview window when facing the visa officer. If you don't have any prior rejections, this should not be a problem.

//Can i go ahead and prepare for GMAT.//

Sure you can. Anybody is free to write the GMAT and send in applications to US bschools. A better question to ponder on is why you want to do an MBA.

Looking to do an MBA with the only (primary) intent of being able to gain entry to the US might not be the right thing to do. To gain admission to a good bschool, you will need to think a little deeper. Here are some thoughts:
1) Why do you want to do an MBA, apart from being able to gain entry to the US?
2) You are into "selling" mutual funds, and "recruiting" for IT. Why not MBA in sales and marketing? Why finance?
3) What do you want to do after you graduate with your MBA?
4) Would you be able to weave your responses to the above 3 points into a proper believable story?

I believe that there are quite a few "pop and mom" bschools that you might be able to get into without the above thinking/story, but then what would you do after you graduate? Once again, a seasoned immigration lawyer/professional would be best here, but from my experience, I know that even if you are able to get into the US on a student (F1) visa, after you graduate with your MBA, you get a year's "license" to work (OPT) within which time you will need to get yourself an H1 visa - that would (re)start the very loop that you are trying to avoid.

//Can you recommend books for preparation.//

I think Sameer has already recommended some excellent books that you can get started with.

//Domains are different but what i do is the same sales/ marketing.//

Needs to be woven into the story. In your case, you will need to explain why you want to pursue an MBA in finance though for the most part you have been in sales/marketing.

//I want to bring many changes in myself. I do not know how friendly people in the US would be. I would be facing a big challenge if i happen to go to us for education or on work permit.//

If you can answer the questions above, build a credible and believable story, and do your MBA for the right reasons, I think factors such as "friendliness of people in the US" would be the least of your concerns. Whether you go to the US (or any other country) on an educational VISA or work permit, the final goal is the same - do be able to do good work and contribute to that country in a meaningful way. If you show enough promise, they will grant you a visa(s) (and keep extending it/them), and things will keep falling in place. Therefore, the story is very important.

//I have my family members living there which is a comforting factor.//

If you have family members in the US, the option of them sponsoring you for an immigrant visa might be a better one than all these F1 and H1 hoops and loops. Have you considered this option?

Regards,
Amit.

Recaptcha,

//However, after seeing the technical side of things was interested to shift to the commercial/ management side of things.//

What specific commercial/management roles did you take a liking to?

//Hence, appeared for CAT and managed to get a seat at one of the IITs for pursuing MBA 2012-14 batch. Consequently, I have resigned from my job and waiting for the classes to begin. But, I strongly believe that this might not be the very best of opportunities and so planning to apply for some good US B schools right this year for 2013-15 session.//

Why did this US bschool option come to you as an afterthought? Goes back to my earlier question - What specific roles did you take a liking to? Rephrased - Why do you want to do an MBA? How (and why) do you feel an MBA from a US bschool would help you fulfill your dreams and aspirations better than bschools at one of the IITs?

Have you thought about other factors:
1) With 18 months of work experience, you would be at the sweet spot of Indian bschools, but right at the bottom of the pile (considering years of work experience) at US bschools. It will not be easy.
2) Finances - Very few fellowships are offered at US bschools. There are also very few assistantships/associateships. For the latter, candidates with more experience are considered. Would you be able to support yourself financially ($100k - $200k, depending on which school you go to)?
3) The MBA - Have you thought about the concentration/specialization you are going to pursue in bschool? Learning at most top bschools being experiential, do you have enough experience to contribute in a meaningful way in classroom discussions? Have you given a thought to what specific areas/topics you are going to focus on (rephrased - choice of electives)?
4) Story - Once you have answers to questions in point 3, you will need to work on a credible/believable story that would connect your past (work at automobile firm), with your present (specialization, concentration, focus) and future (profession after MBA).

If you think you can get all of this done for the current session, then please go ahead. In my opinion, that isn't going to be easy and your application might end up being a half-baked one.

//I doubt if there had been any such cases of students leaving a school midway for some better school.//
//I am sure this must be a peculiar case that you are seeing and probably the first one of sorts.//

Happens more often than you think. One of my seniors at IIT left midway for a top-10 US school - he had a very good reason for it though. Students in Europe and US switch schools (and transfer their credits) every now and then.

//If I take admission in the IIT and start my coursework, can I apply simultaneously abroad to B- Schools. Wont these schools see it in bad light?//

No one is going to stop you from applying to another bschool simultaneously. What I know is that some US bschools have a policy of not accepting applications from those that already have an MBA. Since you have already resigned from your job, bschool admissions staff will surely ask you questions such as "why have you been sitting idle for the last n months?" If you choose to tell them that you are currently pursuing an MBA at some other bshool, I think you will need to do a fair bit of explaining.

Conclusion: Give a thought to the 4 points above. If you think you are fine with all of them, please go ahead and apply to US bschools for the 2013-15 session. If not, get a job in the specific "commercial/management" role that you have taken a liking to, and see if you really like it. You have 2-3 years to experiment. During this time, make sure that you gain solid experience. Invest in Sameer's book, participate in discussions in these forums, as well as on businessweek forums. That way, in 3 years, hopefully you will be ready with a great story that even the best business schools would not be able to reject.

Best of luck.

-Amit.

Hello Sameer,

I m a b.tech 4th year student. i have planned to prepare for MBA entrance exams after graduation while doing a job. But I am a bit confused. let me put it before you...

1. If in any case, my job doesn't allow me to take out time (maybe because of working hours) to prepare, will that be a good option to leave that job before a few months of the exams?? Will it mark a wrong impression?

2. What if i choose a teaching job instead after my graduation, in a college/or coaching/or institute......(teaching would be on my stream of engineering). Will that be considered as a work experience?

3. Even if i m working, how far is my organization will support me if I want to pursue MBA after a few years of job (and i choose to work for the same company after that) By support, i mean granting me a leave on sat and sun......or some other steps to reduce my working hours. Because they also will be requiring experienced employees with an MBA degree.

4.lastly, are these things also come under a 'work experience'??
a. Internship for a few months before a job.
b. i m also working with an NGO and we we organize various events for social cause. I also go to teach slum children every sat-sun.

Waiting for your reply. Hope you will show me the right direction.
thank you :)

Shantanu,

//1. If in any case, my job doesn't allow me to take out time (maybe because of working hours) to prepare, will that be a good option to leave that job before a few months of the exams?? Will it mark a wrong impression?//

Thousands of prospective applicants will be in a similar situation. For most of them, their regular jobs will leave them with little time to study after work. Most are going to make the best use of their weekends to make up for "lost" time during weekdays, though some are going to take time off work, along the lines of what you are thinking.

If you take up a job that requires you to work late nights + weekends, you won't have much of an option - you will need to take some time off right before your exams. However, for most applicants, weekends + a few hours during weekdays is enough.

Also, by the time exams are around the corner, you would be in your job for quite a few months, maybe close to a year. By then, you will have accumulated quite a few leaves that you can take right before your exams. That way you can hang on to your job (no "gap" in your work experience) and therefore no "wrong impression" worries.

//2. What if i choose a teaching job instead after my graduation, in a college/or coaching/or institute......(teaching would be on my stream of engineering). Will that be considered as a work experience?//

Though it will be considered as "work experience", unless you can build a great story (for the purpose of the final interview before admission) around why you were motivated to take up teaching as a full time job right after your BTech (which I think is quite an uphill task), this would not be the right thing to do.

//3. Even if i m working, how far is my organization will support me if I want to pursue MBA after a few years of job (and i choose to work for the same company after that) By support, i mean granting me a leave on sat and sun......or some other steps to reduce my working hours. Because they also will be requiring experienced employees with an MBA degree.//

If I understand your right, I don't think you coming back to work for them after your MBA is going to be a strong enough bargaining chip for them to give you extra time off. True they will require experienced employees with MBAs, but then they would have enough MBAs to pick and choose from.

I am not being able to follow your "...mean granting me a leave on sat and sun..." point. Aren't most companies off on at least Sundays, if not on both Saturdays and Sundays? Sometimes there might be fires to be doused, that might require you to work during a weekend or two, but most of them should be free anyway.

//4.lastly, are these things also come under a 'work experience'??
a. Internship for a few months before a job.//

Based on my experience, most companies don't consider internships as "real" work experience, though they will probably give it some weight. Of course some companies do - depends.

//b. i m also working with an NGO and we we organize various events for social cause. I also go to teach slum children every sat-sun.//

This is good to have on your resume - more like icing on the cake; the cake is primary though.

Conclusion: If I were you, I would join my job, and plan as I go along, and not give as much thought right now on how to handle MBA prep in parallel. Things will sort themselves out with time.

All the best.

-Amit.

Hi

I have always felt that I need to do proper academic study.. but what I did was distance education in B.Sc, MCA and PGDIM ( just the final project paper of MBA @IGNOU was not submitted).. now after 16 years of IT experience of which 6 yrs in US and Australia..I have resigned my jobs to sit at home and wonder what's my next step.. now this gives off my intelligence and my decision taking ability.. i am searching for the next job, irrational as it sounds..stuck to this forum to find do I want to really do an Exec. MBA anywhere in the world or in India.. with not a sound financial balance .. what will be the advice. thanks in advance..

Cheers

Perthsundar,

I think your question - "...do I want to really do an Exec. MBA..." - can be simplified and rephrased as:

1. What do I want to be 5 years from now?
2. Is an Executive MBA going to help me get there?

I have always found this approach of fixing a long term target and charting your path backwards (starting from the target to where you are today) very effective in career planning. It forces you to analyze each and every little step along the way in detail, and therefore forces you to think about the value/relevance of each of those steps.

My suggestion is to give these two questions a hard thought. Once you are done thinking, we can take this discussion forward.

-Amit

Hi Amit,

Many thanks for your response. Will do as advised.


Regards
Sundar

hey amit
thanks for your reply......i got your point..... and now i will empty my mind and focus on job first, and then prepare simultaneously....

thanks again :)